mre29 1340 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 Anyone read this Variety article from last week? Most-Watched Television Networks: Ranking 2023’s Winners and Losers You can click through to read the entire article and see the full tables (one for total viewers, the other for the top 50 for adults 18-49), but for this board's purposes, I'll just note the following from t he total viewers table: Quote 5. Fox News 8. MSNBC 22. CNN 51. Newsmax 69. HLN (tied with HBO) 71. CNBC 89. Newsnation 92. Fox Business Network Are business news channels just not a thing anymore? Because CNBC was just barely beat out by a channel that should be in The Walking Dead. Quote HBO and its linear premium cable counterparts: The pay TV channels have been at the forefront of sending viewers to their streaming counterparts, and that has given them some of the biggest declines of any channels this year. That starts with HBO, down a tremendous 34% among viewers, with Showtime down 25% and Starz down 31%. Starz Encore and Cinemax weren’t even measured this year. I'm guessing a lot of viewers were getting the Max (nee HBO Max) streaming service as part of their HBO subscription and realized the streamer was more valuable to them than the linear channels. I'm also guessing it's the main channels that were tracked, not all of the digital multicast channels. Time to wind those down, I'd say. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningNews 1291 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 The business channels were always geared more for trading floors and c-suite types. This doesn’t surprise me. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MediaZone4K 1511 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 (edited) HLN tied with HBO, I didn't think HLN had that many viewers. CBS dethrowned as most watched! No surprise that kids television isn't doing well. I recently saw Adult swim on Cartoon Network on at 5 PM which used to air around 10. Articles I read up say it's because they're going more for their adult audience since kids aren't watching. It sucks, but well before screaming became a cultural mainstream none of the kids networks produced a consistent class of hit shows since about 2013. How much profit in commercials can TV networks realistically make with less than 500,000 viewers? I guess if those numbers can work for social media/youtube it might stand for television? Edited January 8 by MediaZone4K 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrschimpf 2051 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Cheddar is going through cutbacks and furloughs itself; you can argue most of the regular business audience has long moved onto more niche services and platforms such as Reddit, leaving these networks to adjust to the most mainstream audience (thus the graphics changes), or like Fox Business, being a barely-disguised annex of their mother news channel. Why wait for your favorite stock to appear on a ticker when you can just call it up easily on any device? They're usually viewed in public places, but you're beginning to see that slip; many McDonald's over the last few months have switched from the cable news channels to Atomsphere TV, a service purposefully designed to just be visual informative noise without any of the 'here's a story, and now a partisan debate' claptrap of cable news. Businesses are finally realizing that live TV in a public place is just a pointless expense when someone will pay to have you put their experience in for free. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoopInTheHouse 63 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 A small surprise was Hogar De HGTV at 154th and Galanovelas at 148th. Hell, the most watched Spanish network of 2023 was UNIVISION at 7th. Just goes to show how Spanish-speaking people don’t respect good TV these days, even if it’s in Español. (Except the telenovelas that has the same amount of budget as the cost of a Subway footlong). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodfreyGR 493 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 12 hours ago, MediaZone4K said: CBS dethrowned as most watched! Only so many people who want to watch Big Brother, Survivor, and Amazing Race seemingly non-stop. Writers strike, sure- but that was an issue for every network to maneuver last year. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mre29 1340 Posted January 8 Author Share Posted January 8 On 1/6/2024 at 8:44 PM, MediaZone4K said: HLN tied with HBO, I didn't think HLN had that many viewers. I didn't think HBO had that few. On 1/6/2024 at 8:44 PM, MediaZone4K said: How much profit in commercials can TV networks realistically make with less than 500,000 viewers? This is why I'm waiting for the inevitable mass-culling of cable channels. There are so many channels that aren't pulling their own weight and are still around only because they're bundled with their more popular siblings. At some point, one of the parent companies -- Disney, Comcast/NBCU, WBD, Paramount, etc. -- needs to say, "Yeah, this isn't working out anymore." and start winding channels down. But which company is going to blink first? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abraham J. Simpson 303 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 22 hours ago, GodfreyGR said: Only so many people who want to watch Big Brother, Survivor, and Amazing Race seemingly non-stop. Writers strike, sure- but that was an issue for every network to maneuver last year. Survivor and Amazing Race aired once weekly, same as usual. Big Brother had a fairly limited holiday run, apart from its customary summer filler role. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MediaZone4K 1511 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 (edited) 4 hours ago, Abraham J. Simpson said: Survivor and Amazing Race aired once weekly, same as usual. Big Brother had a fairly limited holiday run, apart from its customary summer filler role. But I see what @GodfreyGR was getting, at. It seems both shows are always on past the point of caring anymore, much like The Voice on NBC and The Bachelor on ABC. I don't fault CBS for sticking to what works, but their routine of recycled police procedural franchises and comedies becomes repetitive and generic. I was also surprised at HBO's ratings were that low despite the critical acclaim of a lot of their shows. Edited January 8 by MediaZone4K 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrschimpf 2051 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 On 1/6/2024 at 10:30 PM, CoopInTheHouse said: A small surprise was Hogar De HGTV at 154th and Galanovelas at 148th. Hell, the most watched Spanish network of 2023 was UNIVISION at 7th. Just goes to show how Spanish-speaking people don’t respect good TV these days, even if it’s in Español. (Except the telenovelas that has the same amount of budget as the cost of a Subway footlong). Hogar is more severe undermarketing than anything else; it was intended to have a broader launch, but WBD happened and Zazlav probably starved its budget and like Discovery Family, it's probably stuck in the hands of some middle manager who doesn't speak any Spanish. And the latter is mainly because it's Spanish TV Land where the same older novelas are ran over and over and the network is a loss leader for TU; they don't really look at the ratings for it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodfreyGR 493 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 1 hour ago, MediaZone4K said: But I see where @GodfreyGR was going, at. It seems both shows are always on past the point of caring anymore much like The Voice in NBC and The Bachelor on ABC. I don't fall CBS for sticking to what works, but their routine of recycled police procedural franchises and comedies becomes repetitive and generic. I was also surprised at HBO's ratings were that low despite the critical acclaim of a lot of their shows. Gracias for the hat tip- and to your point, all the networks have found their crutch/niche... And I think much of it boils down to- what is exciting outside of those niches to watch? When NFL Games make up 93% of the most-watched TV programs in 2023, the message seems to be clear that the viewers are tired of the same reality shows, singing competitions, and legal/cop dramas. Which network finds the new big program or genre and reinvents "Must See TV"? Or... Have we passed a point of no return? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrschimpf 2051 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 4 hours ago, MediaZone4K said: I was also surprised at HBO's ratings were that low despite the critical acclaim of a lot of their shows. Don't forget though this is counting all 168 hours of programming a week for HBO; they might get great ratings during those two-three nights of primetime, but otherwise it's the 478th replay of "88 Minutes" or "Now You See Me 2". Most of those customers use HBO's VOD service or Max outside those hours. Same with Showtime or Starz; by design those ratings are low because the need to follow a schedule has long been negated and is just there more for DVR scheduling a movie you want to see and FF/rewind without cable VOD restrictions, than actual organic tune-in. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abraham J. Simpson 303 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 Indeed, and linear viewership numbers for premium networks are not meaningful. Even their prestige shows get heavy use on streaming/video-on-demand, and it's not an ad model. Apples to cucumbers. It's not so much that NFL games getting the biggest audiences means audiences are not watching other shows, it's that the NFL shows the value of live event programming with mass appeal. It doesn't exist, meaningfully, anywhere else. But you can find just about any flavor of cop show, including international ones, at any hour day or night. CBS makes money on the procedurals in first-run and syndication because they do work. Not like in 1990 because the world is dramatically different. You're never going to get "Must See TV" back when you give the audience that many choices, no matter what you put on. Some will watch in real time, many will DVR/on-demand/stream. The whole ecosystem is part of the calculus, not just one component. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrannical bastard 3444 Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 (edited) 12 hours ago, mre29 said: This is why I'm waiting for the inevitable mass-culling of cable channels. There are so many channels that aren't pulling their own weight and are still around only because they're bundled with their more popular siblings. At some point, one of the parent companies -- Disney, Comcast/NBCU, WBD, Paramount, etc. -- needs to say, "Yeah, this isn't working out anymore." and start winding channels down. But which company is going to blink first? Operationally, how different are these actual cable channels compared to the FAST channels? They have to be operated similarly as automated video jukeboxes playing a "list" of content from the master log. All it takes is someone to ingest the stuff so it plays at the right time, and maybe a producer or two producing the promos and interstitial content. It's not like the TV of old where it actually took manpower to run a channel. And since channel capacity is a thing of the past, what actual cost savings would this realize? Satellite space? A power bill on the server? Or just another bloated excuse to cull back content because it's too "expensive"... Edited January 8 by tyrannical bastard 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodfreyGR 493 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 7 hours ago, tyrannical bastard said: Operationally, how different are these actual cable channels compared to the FAST channels? They have to be operated similarly as automated video jukeboxes playing a "list" of content from the master log. All it takes is someone to ingest the stuff so it plays at the right time, and maybe a producer or two producing the promos and interstitial content. It's not like the TV of old where it actually took manpower to run a channel. And since channel capacity is a thing of the past, what actual cost savings would this realize? Satellite space? A power bill on the server? Or just another bloated excuse to cull back content because it's too "expensive"... All of this- and as long as there's advertisers and the channel is turning a profit on the balance sheet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyrannical bastard 3444 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 1 hour ago, GodfreyGR said: All of this- and as long as there's advertisers and the channel is turning a profit on the balance sheet... Also depends on how the channels are sold to advertisers. If it's purely "added value" on a primary investment.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjj 2 Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Me TV at #21 was pretty surprising to me but then then you look at the 18-49 numbers below (and the lack of Me TV) and realize that more than 80% of their audience is over 50 years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megatron81 179 Posted January 17 Share Posted January 17 I still like to watch live only use OnDemand to catch up only if I have another show at the same time, along with sports. Like I will watch Wild Cards & Family Law OnDemand on Fri or sometime over the weekend. Like I was surprised that On Patrol Live is still the number 1 TV show on Fri & Sat nights being on Reelz a smaller network than A&E when it was Live PD, I watch OP: Live late night on the weekends 12AM to 3AM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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