TV's Awful Decline

[Rusty Muck 4017]

On 1/14/2023 at 4:21 PM, bpatrick said:

What happened to docudramas?  Remember in the '70s "Pueblo" and "The Missiles of October," to name just two?  Why can you not find a program like "The World at War" on a broadcast station?  I even remember one year in the '60s when ABC had "FDR," CBS had "World War I," and NBC had "Profiles in Courage" either in prime time or just before.
My students have a very limited knowledge of history; shows like these could entertain as well as teach, and perhaps we teachers could use some of the made-for-TV movies to point out factual errors.

That’s literally what PBS does on a daily basis.

[MediaZone4K 1197]

On 1/3/2023 at 9:10 PM, VHSgoodiesWA said:

Do NOT get me started on cable TV. What was entertaining (Cubs games and Bozo on WGN, great movies and Night Tracks on TBS, Cartoon Express on USA etc.) has become a wasteland of binge-watching repeats, zillions of commercials (of which Limu Emu gets at least 1/3 of the airtime), and reality shows that keep getting worse by the year. TruTV aired 'Jurassic World' last night. The channel for live, rolling court coverage and analysis is now running not just hours of Impractical Jokers, but also MOVIES. What gives! Nickelodeon = zillions of SpongeBob repeats with oodles of commercials. Food Network = tons of food competitions, very few how-to cooking shows. Where art thou, Essence of Emeril, Barefoot Contessa, etc.? TWC spends all night running Highway Through Hell repeats (and all day on weekends) and once in a while, they will shove those away if there's major tornadoes. The ghosts of Dr. John Hope and Dave Schwartz haunt the studios, I bet. What was Chuck Roberts and Gordon Graham on Headline News 24 hours a day has turned into WEST WING repeats. Oh, and a zillion Forensic Files showings. Might as well call it TNT2 at this point. TLC's constant reality garbage, same with Bravo, USA, MTV, Discovery Channel. GSN's constant Harvey Feud repeats, too! Isn't he on a few other cable channels...TVLand maybe?

 

Honestly, I'd be fine only getting ESPN, ESPN2, and a few other sports networks a la carte. The rest of cable TV is garbage. Yes, that includes CNN/FOX News/MSNBC. 

 

Honestly, I stopped watching TV for the most part after the start of the pandemic. And for the most part, except for some sports, and maybe the local news, I haven't come back. I would rather watch a classic movie or Seinfeld repeat than 95% of what's on TV nowadays.

 

RANT OVER.

On top of all of this, cable companies have the nerve to charge into the hundreds for basic cable --while providing poor and slow customer service -- yet act puzzled as to why cord cutting is the new norm.

Loved South Park's take on this:

[TheFizzle21 39]

There was a point in time in 2018 or 2019 that I thought to myself and realized....there's hardly any scripted TV shows on television that people want to see, mainly because, as someone alluded to earlier, these companies put their money where their mouths are, and that's with the streaming services. I mean...is it safe to say all these big 4 networks have outside of reality, news, and sports are their legacy shows? NBC with their Law & Order trifecta...ABC and Grey's Anatomy...CBS continuing on with NCIS after all this time....Fox with two Sunday night animated comedies in Family Guy and The Simpsons, I guess? One thing's for sure, nobody I know is flocking to the TV for the newest ABC drama or CBS' next big comedy led by a well-known actor. This leads me into my next point.

 

Appointment television. I miss the hell out of it, or at least what comes with it. When I used to watch Chuck on NBC, I had quite a number of days where I'd hop on Twitter and follow along with everyone watching the show at the same time. I did this with a few other shows and a quite often once I found subreddits in Reddit for my favorite shows. That level of camaraderie is something you can't replicate with a Netflix or Disney+ show that rolls out new episodes at 3am on a Wednesday or Friday. While this isn't going to take away from whether or not people enjoy a series, appointment TV is something that'll rarely be seen, or at least not in the droves that it would lead to if you had to tune into a show at 8 or try and watch a DVR recording a week before the next episode.

[DirtyHarry 714]

1 hour ago, TheFizzle21 said:

There was a point in time in 2018 or 2019 that I thought to myself and realized....there's hardly any scripted TV shows on television that people want to see, mainly because, as someone alluded to earlier, these companies put their money where their mouths are, and that's with the streaming services. I mean...is it safe to say all these big 4 networks have outside of reality, news, and sports are their legacy shows? NBC with their Law & Order trifecta...ABC and Grey's Anatomy...CBS continuing on with NCIS after all this time....Fox with two Sunday night animated comedies in Family Guy and The Simpsons, I guess? One thing's for sure, nobody I know is flocking to the TV for the newest ABC drama or CBS' next big comedy led by a well-known actor. This leads me into my next point.

 

Appointment television. I miss the hell out of it, or at least what comes with it. When I used to watch Chuck on NBC, I had quite a number of days where I'd hop on Twitter and follow along with everyone watching the show at the same time. I did this with a few other shows and a quite often once I found subreddits in Reddit for my favorite shows. That level of camaraderie is something you can't replicate with a Netflix or Disney+ show that rolls out new episodes at 3am on a Wednesday or Friday. While this isn't going to take away from whether or not people enjoy a series, appointment TV is something that'll rarely be seen, or at least not in the droves that it would lead to if you had to tune into a show at 8 or try and watch a DVR recording a week before the next episode.

 

They can stream all they want, but they're never going to get me. And to be honest, I don't really miss anything they're not offering anymore enough to pay. Pretty stupid and shortsighted to give up the biggest platform they have. If anything, they should augment it with social media, sending texts, reminding people to go into their TV set to watch a show.

 

I use the free streaming plenty, so I'm not just some old guy who refuses to try something new. I just think the free OTA platform is easiest and most convenient for people. I pay for the local newspaper and the Wall Street Journal. Anything else I have to pay for, I can live without.

[MediaZone4K 1197]

On 2/3/2023 at 3:58 PM, TheFizzle21 said:

There was a point in time in 2018 or 2019 that I thought to myself and realized....there's hardly any scripted TV shows on television that people want to see, mainly because, as someone alluded to earlier, these companies put their money where their mouths are, and that's with the streaming services. I mean...is it safe to say all these big 4 networks have outside of reality, news, and sports are their legacy shows? NBC with their Law & Order trifecta...ABC and Grey's Anatomy...CBS continuing on with NCIS after all this time....Fox with two Sunday night animated comedies in Family Guy and The Simpsons, I guess? One thing's for sure, nobody I know is flocking to the TV for the newest ABC drama or CBS' next big comedy led by a well-known actor. This leads me into my next point.

 

Appointment television. I miss the hell out of it, or at least what comes with it. When I used to watch Chuck on NBC, I had quite a number of days where I'd hop on Twitter and follow along with everyone watching the show at the same time. I did this with a few other shows and a quite often once I found subreddits in Reddit for my favorite shows. That level of camaraderie is something you can't replicate with a Netflix or Disney+ show that rolls out new episodes at 3am on a Wednesday or Friday. While this isn't going to take away from whether or not people enjoy a series, appointment TV is something that'll rarely be seen, or at least not in the droves that it would lead to if you had to tune into a show at 8 or try and watch a DVR recording a week before the next episode.

Appointment television was the best. The most recent instances I can recall were Empire on Fox, Shonda's TGIT on ABC and now the Dick Wolf blocks on NBC. Maybe this becomes the new trend: show creators taking over a single night on a network. 

 

We've probably discussed his before but the scripted cable series bubble has largely burst. There was a time AMC,  MTV, VH1, Lifetime, USA E! and others were clammoring to put out original dramas and comedies. Now aisde from HBO, Hallmark, BET,  and maybe TBS, non children aimed cable channels have largely stuck to reruns, live sports reality shows and movies. (Not counting Lifeime movies as a continuning series). 

 

TV networks probably thought that prestige programming might bring them noteriety or an audience, but I know alot of people who've heard of Schitt's Creek --from streaming -- but couldn't tell me it originated from the Pop! Network. 

 

Will *new episode* streaming sydication ever become a thing? A studio makes a show (that doesnt have a home network) avalible on multiple streaming platforms owned by different companies.

Edited February 5 by iron_lion

[compubit 642]

1 hour ago, iron_lion said:

TV networks probably thought that prestige programming might bring them noteriety or an audience, but I know alot of people who've heard of Schitt's Creek --from streaming -- but couldn't tell me it originated from the Pop! Network. .

Actually Schitt’s Creek originated on Canada’s CBC. Pop! just technically picked it up in foreign syndication…

[DirtyHarry 714]

Right now, the main advantage I see with free streaming is that the picture quality is generally better than OTA. The main OTA Channel may look good, but subchannels tend to be fuzzier. ATSC 3.0 is supposed to alleviate that. If that's what ends up happening, I don't really see what you need cable TV for. Just program the sub channels better and put everything up on there and make it easy for people.

[VHSgoodiesWA 257]

Shows like 24, Alias, and Smallville had huge 'appointment TV' fan bases. Everyone had to wait until the next episode and were predicting what would happen next to the characters. But that was going on 20 years ago.

 

With Dr. Phil and (likely) Rachael Ray closing the curtains this year, broadcast syndication continues to decline too. It's cheaper to sell more lawyer and political advertising during a 3:00 or 4:00 newscast. Cheaper costs for the station as they don't need a Hollywood broadcast crew to do it.

[MediaZone4K 1197]

This video explains the concept of "channel drift" really well, a topic we've heavily discussed.

 

I recall Flavor of Love, I Love New York, Keeping up with the Kardashians and Rev Run's House really signaled the programing shift in the mid 2000s for me. At least Game Show Network, Food Network and HGTV have largely retained their niche.

 

[newsteam13 343]

According to the Nielsen website (CLICK HERE), the majority of us Americans are streaming MORE than watching OTA and Cable TV.

 

Most people aren't coming home to watch the local newscasts on TV. People get their news online. Gone are the days of local newscasts at convenient viewing times.

 

How are local stations getting with the times? I tried finding local stations to stream live on my ROKU TV but no luck there.

 

I do know that Paramount+ not only lets me stream CBS shows, but there's a way to watch my local CBS affiliate LIVE with commercials with my subscription. On the Peacock streaming service, I discovered that for $10 more a month, I could stream my local NBC affiliate LIVE.

[MediaZone4K 1197]

 

18 minutes ago, newsteam13 said:

According to the Nielsen website (CLICK HERE), the majority of us Americans are streaming MORE than watching OTA and Cable TV.

 

Most people aren't coming home to watch the local newscasts on TV. People get their news online. Gone are the days of local newscasts at convenient viewing times.

 

How are local stations getting with the times? I tried finding local stations to stream live on my ROKU TV but no luck there.

 

I do know that Paramount+ not only lets me stream CBS shows, but there's a way to watch my local CBS affiliate LIVE with commercials with my subscription. On the Peacock streaming service, I discovered that for $10 more a month, I could stream my local NBC affiliate LIVE.

I'm surprised cable still beats broadcast viewership. The main reason I can assume is that cable (and satellite barring severe weather) gurantees a clear signal. OTA digital channels glitch and sometimes are temporarily unavalible due to poorer signal and antenna brands.

Edited April 13 by MediaZone4K

[sfomspphl 420]

1 hour ago, MediaZone4K said:

 

I'm surprised cable still beats broadcast viewership. The main reason I can assume is that cable (and satellite barring severe weather) gurantees a clear signal. OTA digital channels glitch and sometimes are temporarily unavalible due to poorer signal and antenna brands.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, MediaZone4K said:

 

I'm surprised cable still beats broadcast viewership. The main reason I can assume is that cable (and satellite barring severe weather) gurantees a clear signal. OTA digital channels glitch and sometimes are temporarily unavalible due to poorer signal and antenna brands.

 

 

I think the way they're categorizing, 'broadcast' means broadcast networks / channels viewed via any distribution (OTA, cable, stream), and 'cable' literally means 'cable networks' vs using a cable provider. 

 

The other surprising thing from this month...

 

The top viewing items for very young women (18-34) are 15-25+ year old reruns, the old syndication business for local TV. 

 

https://www.nielsen.com/insights/2023/with-almost-1-million-video-choices-women-18-34-turn-to-classic-tv/

[DirtyHarry 714]

I don't watch anything new, although I do admit that the commercials for the new True Lies series make it look like it would be an interesting show. But I doubt I will get into the habit of watching it.

I miss the days of shows like The Fugitive. It was a pretty simple formula.

 

1. Richard Kimble and a new city tracking down the one armed man, 

2. Worksa menial job,

3. Makes friends with a co-worker or somebody in that town,

4. Something goes wrong and puts him in jeopardy,

5. Moral lesson: He always steps up and does the right thing, even if it puts him in jeopardy.

 

Shows these days either preach to us about something (race, gays, transgender) or incorporate too much of the gutter lifestyle.

 

That's why I like watching the old shows. Simple and I don't feel like I have to scrub myself clean after watching them.

Edited April 13 by DirtyHarry

[VHSgoodiesWA 257]

7 hours ago, DirtyHarry said:

Shows these days either preach to us about something (race, gays, transgender) or incorporate too much of the gutter lifestyle.

 

That's why I like watching the old shows. Simple and I don't feel like I have to scrub myself clean after watching them.

Give me an old John Wayne or Perry Mason/Raymond Burr classic any day. Cheers, Seinfeld, Home Improvement too. The Conners is one of the few first-run sitcoms left that still follows a classic comedic format, not modernized and PC. It's been the trend for a good 10 years and especially took over during and post-Covid.

[SlimyTrain 3]

10 hours ago, newsteam13 said:

According to the Nielsen website (CLICK HERE), the majority of us Americans are streaming MORE than watching OTA and Cable TV.

 

Most people aren't coming home to watch the local newscasts on TV. People get their news online. Gone are the days of local newscasts at convenient viewing times.

 

How are local stations getting with the times? I tried finding local stations to stream live on my ROKU TV but no luck there.

 

I do know that Paramount+ not only lets me stream CBS shows, but there's a way to watch my local CBS affiliate LIVE with commercials with my subscription. On the Peacock streaming service, I discovered that for $10 more a month, I could stream my local NBC affiliate LIVE.

I've seen this graphic so many times I- 

Also, what do they count as "other"?

[mre29 1246]

2 hours ago, VHSgoodiesWA said:

Give me an old John Wayne or Perry Mason/Raymond Burr classic any day. Cheers, Seinfeld, Home Improvement too. The Conners is one of the few first-run sitcoms left that still follows a classic comedic format, not modernized and PC.

 

You do know The Conners isn't the only sitcom that has laugh tracks, right?

 

[MediaZone4K 1197]

Jon Stewart clearly has his biases but he usually presents a fair arguement and this was no exception. He displayed how the right wing media takes overblown talking points and perfectly executes them into national movements and conversations. Conversely, he showed that the admittedly left leaning mainstream news media (and further left CNN and MSNBC) idealize themselves as the "seeking truth to power" alternative, but poorly execute that mission. He used CNN and MSNBC's over coverage of the Mueller Report --- which resulted in nothing --- as evidence. He even took a jab at his own streamer Apple Tv. This was a pretty good analysis, finding that even though Fox News gets most of the heat, MSNBC, CNN (and to a lesser extent the big three) all have their isssues.

Edited May 6 by MediaZone4K

[mre29 1246]

On 4/13/2023 at 9:58 PM, SlimyTrain said:

I've seen this graphic so many times I- 

Also, what do they count as "other"?

 

Physical media, I'm guessing. DVDs, Blu-rays, laserdiscs, VHS, Betamax, 35mm film reels, etc.

 

[DirtyHarry 714]

@MediaZone4K - local news is okay, but the national news media has become Pravda for the Deep State. Anything on the national level is not to be trusted anymore. All it is is talking points fed to the media from political flacks. 

 

The funny one is Hunter Biden, who is actually involved in illegalities, along with his dad, given a pass. But they gleefully go after Trump over and over again and can't find a thing. He may be the cleanest person to ever run for the presidency. Oh and we have that Scooter Libby and Valerie Plame thing. A nothingburger, but they started beating the drums. I have no respect for the national media at all. All these phony scandals have turned me off to all these people.

 

Scandal against Republicans and throw the book at them for jaywalking, Democrats always get a pass for major violations of the law. I'm not standing up for Republicans -- I hate the DC Republican Party, but that's what I see.

Edited April 24 by DirtyHarry

[MediaZone4K 1197]

Back to decline of local news, I believe shrinking newrooms and the rise of the Multi Media Journalist position is a huge contributor. I'm seeing so many local stations with less than 10 reporters who have to edit, film, write and report all in one. 

 

Unfortunately, the increased work load hasn't translated to higher pay, especially not now with shrinking revenue streams. But a job requiring reporters to move to small market boondocks -- often away from any familial financial support structure--must pay better. It's crazy that people employed in television are paid retail level wages and need to live with roomates despite working a job requiring a bachelor's degree. To add to that, reporters are locked into to two to three year contracts sometimes with post employment non compete clauses.

 

IMO get rid of or shorten contracts for reporters (at least those being paid low in smaller markets). Stop post employment non competes (in states where it's legal). People care more about where anchors land than reporters. This is a big ask but raise the pay. It allows people from diverese fianncial backgrounds to enter the field. A job requiring a degree should at least pay $1K a week, or at the very minuimum allow for the worker to have all basic needs met. Have realitic deadline and story output expectations as newsrooms shrink. Many reporters are qutting the industry over burnout. 

 

Journalism is a great and exicitng field but it has major drawbacks. 

Edited May 26 by MediaZone4K

[TheRob 905]

In terms of audience decline, late news (11s and 10s) viewership is down 10-30% nationwide year-to-year.

[newscopter7 187]

On 1/3/2023 at 9:10 PM, VHSgoodiesWA said:

Broadcast primetime TV is a mix of stale sitcoms, tons of stale and stupid reality shows, the same washed-out crime dramas (i.e., CBS's THREE FBI: "Insert Here" shows, multiple NCIS shows, multiple CSIs) and the same washed-out medical dramas. Then they jump the shark, add relationships to the shows instead of focusing on the premise of the program. The Good Doctor used to be about an autistic savant doctor. Now, it's about his relationships with women and the relationships between other doctors/nurses at the hospital. Grey's Anatomy - same thing.

The Goldbergs keeps going even though the 'kids' are now in their early-to-late 20s. I don't know how they do, the show has jumped the shark since the loss of George Segal and Jeff Garlin's departure. Abbott Elementary isn't that bad, on the other hand, and nor is Ghosts on CBS, but sitcoms for the most part have no life to them anymore. And yes, political messaging has destroyed many of these primetime shows. They just can't seem to have an unbiased plot on a drama or sitcom anymore - it has to show activism in some way.

 

Game shows - you can't seem to find any contestant on any primetime or daytime show (except maybe Jeopardy!/Wheel) that isn't on five energy drinks' worth of caffeine. The Price is Right is one of the biggest examples, but even the last few primetime shows (The Wheel, Beat Shazam, Press Your Luck) are like this too...

 

Late night TV shows have also declined to new lows. Same jokes about former President Trump EVERY NIGHT on every single show. We get it, I can't stand him either, but he's no longer POTUS. Surely is there anything else to make fun about? Segments are mundane and cookie-cutter compared to previous hosts (Leno's Headlines, Craig Ferguson, Geoff and Secretariat, Carnac on Johnny Carson). They have little to no creative value to viewers. I love Bill Maher, but I don't watch any other late night show. That ship sailed when Letterman, Ferguson, and Leno retired.

 

Even the soap opera fans are noticing extremely poor writing and the lack of nuance on Y&R, B&B and General Hospital, compared to 20-30 years ago. Days already went to Peacock (to die, probably). It looks as though the rest of the soaps are also on life support.

 

Do NOT get me started on cable TV. What was entertaining (Cubs games and Bozo on WGN, great movies and Night Tracks on TBS, Cartoon Express on USA etc.) has become a wasteland of binge-watching repeats, zillions of commercials (of which Limu Emu gets at least 1/3 of the airtime), and reality shows that keep getting worse by the year. TruTV aired 'Jurassic World' last night. The channel for live, rolling court coverage and analysis is now running not just hours of Impractical Jokers, but also MOVIES. What gives! Nickelodeon = zillions of SpongeBob repeats with oodles of commercials. Food Network = tons of food competitions, very few how-to cooking shows. Where art thou, Essence of Emeril, Barefoot Contessa, etc.? TWC spends all night running Highway Through Hell repeats (and all day on weekends) and once in a while, they will shove those away if there's major tornadoes. The ghosts of Dr. John Hope and Dave Schwartz haunt the studios, I bet. What was Chuck Roberts and Gordon Graham on Headline News 24 hours a day has turned into WEST WING repeats. Oh, and a zillion Forensic Files showings. Might as well call it TNT2 at this point. TLC's constant reality garbage, same with Bravo, USA, MTV, Discovery Channel. GSN's constant Harvey Feud repeats, too! Isn't he on a few other cable channels...TVLand maybe?

 

Honestly, I'd be fine only getting ESPN, ESPN2, and a few other sports networks a la carte. The rest of cable TV is garbage. Yes, that includes CNN/FOX News/MSNBC. 

 

Honestly, I stopped watching TV for the most part after the start of the pandemic. And for the most part, except for some sports, and maybe the local news, I haven't come back. I would rather watch a classic movie or Seinfeld repeat than 95% of what's on TV nowadays.

 

RANT OVER.

Days hasn’t gone to Peacock to die. It’s one of Peacock’s most streamed series if not the most. And the show that replaced  it on NBC is pulling 500,000 less viewers than Days. 

[VHSgoodiesWA 257]

That was in January. I stand corrected regarding Days' success on Peacock. That was out of left field and I did not expect that. When Passions went to The 101/DirecTV it was gone at the end of that season.

None of that matters however if the writers' strike continues going on for several more weeks/months. No new episodes of Days will be produced.

[Superdude 105]

On 5/27/2023 at 12:36 AM, VHSgoodiesWA said:

That was in January. I stand corrected regarding Days' success on Peacock. That was out of left field and I did not expect that. When Passions went to The 101/DirecTV it was gone at the end of that season.

None of that matters however if the writers' strike continues going on for several more weeks/months. No new episodes of Days will be produced.

Days infamously films 8-10 months ahead so the other soaps will be affected a lot sooner than days will.

[mrschimpf 1785]

On 5/26/2023 at 11:00 AM, newscopter7 said:

Days hasn’t gone to Peacock to die. It’s one of Peacock’s most streamed series if not the most. And the show that replaced  it on NBC is pulling 500,000 less viewers than Days. 

And no more pre-emptions. In this case the move was needed, and eventually CBS and ABC will have to make the same decisions because if you have news content on and news breaks there's no one to really anger outside the few people who did a feature and didn't see it on TV. It's stupid because press conferences were designed to digest events during the day and be part of a rundown later instead of being covered live, but it's too late to go back to that form of distribution.