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NBC Considering Giving 10pm/9pm Back To Affiliates


Georgie56
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15 hours ago, channel2 said:

It was pointed out that Universal Television wouldn't be happy with having fewer slots to sell shows to NBC in. I'm sure a lot of Hollywood types would need to be pacified as well...

 

(Then again, none of them had any advance knowledge of The WB and UPN joining forces!)

They're so desperate in making Peacock successful that they're willing to sacrifice the network in the process.

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2 hours ago, Superdude said:

They're so desperate in making Peacock successful that they're willing to sacrifice the network in the process.

They “sacrificed the network” when the TV industry became creatively bankrupt in the 2000s. You may not like it, but most TV shows are not all that relevant. NBC is not the only network that is “so desperate” to prioritize streaming, and no company in their right mind would ignore today’s trends and pretend that we live in the 1990s.

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19 hours ago, Gavin M. said:

Fox isn’t going to allow cross simulcast newscast so WRAL will have an affiliate change basically every FOX station might have to be cancelled or be in their own.

False. WRAZ simulcasts with WRAL at 4pm.

 

Once again, simulcasting exists in the year 2022. The concept of 2 stations running the same newscast has been in place for at least 20 years. There is no written or unwritten rule that forbids something from happening just because some people don’t like it.
 

There will be no mass affiliation changes if both NBC and Fox stations run 10pm news. There will be no volcanic eruptions, earthquakes, or tsunamis as a result of NBC and Fox stations running 10pm news. The state of Hawaii has not sunk into the Pacific Ocean just because KGMB/KHNL already simulcast their late news.

 

Stations are not going to blow up their affiliation agreements just because some of us don’t like the idea of a 10pm simulcast.

Edited by nycnewsjunkie
Grammar
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18 hours ago, iron_lion said:

Not that a national newscast at 10 PM is implausible, but Nightly News is a fixture in the evenings after work. It fits its time slot. Would we want to mess with that?

Because The National airs at 10 and American/Canadian work culture isn't too different?

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1 hour ago, TheSpeedKing said:

Because The National airs at 10 and American/Canadian work culture isn't too different?

I was about to say that, if CBC can air a one hour national newscast at 10/9c, why not try it here in America.

 

Another possible idea would be for NBC affiliates to air their late newscast at 10/9c for 75 minutes with The Tonight Show starting at 11:15/10:15c.

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1 hour ago, TheSpeedKing said:

Because The National airs at 10 and American/Canadian work culture isn't too different?

Global at 6:30 (30 minutes), CBC at 10 (hour), and CTV is at 11 (30 minutes) and is the number one newscast in Canada (well, for now; see Lisa LaFlamme for more). Why are the networks given only 30 minutes in the evening? At one time NBC planned on having Nightly News go to a full hour in the early 80s, but nothing happened. 

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24 minutes ago, EVVTV12 said:

Global at 6:30 (30 minutes), CBC at 10 (hour), and CTV is at 11 (30 minutes) and is the number one newscast in Canada (well, for now; see Lisa LaFlamme for more). Why are the networks given only 30 minutes in the evening? At one time NBC planned on having Nightly News go to a full hour in the early 80s, but nothing happened. 

True, most networks in foreign countries (like Canada) have a six and ten newscast. Always found it weird why the US networks never catched on, likely because of our  "local first" vision. BBC airs newscasts at 6 and 10 (formally nine when ITV still had "News at Ten" and so does ITV.

Always also found it weird why for like at 6/5 in the US, local newscast came first then national while internationally (UK especially) it is the opposite. 

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Just now, ATLNewsExpert said:

Always also found it weird why for like at 6/5 in the US, local newscast came first then national while internationally (UK especially) it is the opposite. 

There are a few exceptions. Many affiliates air the CBS Weekend News at 6 Eastern before local news on Sundays if sports do not overrun. And a few West Coast affiliates have started airing network news live from the East Coast at 3:30 PT, before local news broadcasts.

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Variety published an article that says, "this conversation has happened multiple times over the past 10 years, and emphasize this is not the first time the option of ceding time to affiliates has been discussed at the broadcaster." So there is a possibility this might not happen any time soon. 

 

But I do think the Big 3 will contract their primetime schedules at some point. It just makes economic sense. Plus NextGen TV has the ability to bring new revenue streams to broadcast stations. So I think it only wise for the networks and their affiliate bases to start thinking about what their relationship looks like in the future. Perhaps there is a subscription model where NBCUniversal allows USA Network or Bravo to be encrypted on a broadcast signal. The broadcast station could then share some of the revenue with the network.  If people are beholden to the concept than an NBC station must air prime programs from 8-11, news at 11, and Tonight at 11:35 then business will dry up fast. Personally, I'd like to be the first network of the 3 to give the affiliates the 10 p.m. hour and start my late-night programming at 11. You'd rather play leader than play catchup. 

 

17 hours ago, Gavin M. said:

Fox isn’t going to allow cross simulcast newscast so WRAL will have an affiliate change basically every FOX station might have to be cancelled or be in their own.

 

Could I learn more about why you said this? WRAZ airs a simulcast of WRAL News at 6 a.m., 12 p.m., 12:30 p.m. and 4 p.m. So why would FOX not allow a 10 p.m. simulcast?

 

There's also a little ratings trick when it comes to simulcasts. If the simulcast is pure duplication, meaning the exact same feed airs on two different stations then you can combine the ratings. Let's use WRAL/WRAZ as examples because they are referenced above. The 6 a.m. news on WRAL and WRAZ could be touted as combined viewership provided all content (news and ads) are duplicated on each station. That has the potential to widen the audience and thus be more attractive to advertisers. If, however, Capitol Broadcasting airs different commercial breaks on WRAL and WRAZ then the ratings must be broken out separately. As stations fight for revenue, a single primetime newscast shown on two stations could be a good thing from a revenue standpoint. Even if it is lackluster from a creative output. 

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U.S. networks have not expanded beyond 30 minutes because of resistance from the affiliates.  After all, who's going to give up the revenue from "Wheel of Fortune," "Jeopardy!," "ET," or even local news?  In fact, it was when WABC put "Jeopardy!" at 7 and moved "World News Tonight" to 6:30 that affiliates with network newscasts at 7 began moving them to 6:30 (there are a few exceptions, such as WSB, WRC, KDKA, WRGB, and WCAX).  But I have said many times that if I had my own network, my newscast would be on at 10--far more potential viewers than at 6:30.

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5 hours ago, ATLNewsExpert said:

Always also found it weird why for like at 6/5 in the US, local newscast came first then national while internationally (UK especially) it is the opposite. 

But historically in the Central/Mountain (and sometimes Pacific), it was National News at 5:30, followed by local news at 6 (or National at 5, local at 5:30 out west).  If a station had a 5pm newscast (typically larger cities), it was more of a “Live at 5” program, featuring lighter news and features.

 

J

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6 hours ago, carolinanews4 said:

There's also a little ratings trick when it comes to simulcasts. If the simulcast is pure duplication, meaning the exact same feed airs on two different stations then you can combine the ratings. Let's use WRAL/WRAZ as examples because they are referenced above. The 6 a.m. news on WRAL and WRAZ could be touted as combined viewership provided all content (news and ads) are duplicated on each station. That has the potential to widen the audience and thus be more attractive to advertisers. If, however, Capitol Broadcasting airs different commercial breaks on WRAL and WRAZ then the ratings must be broken out separately. As stations fight for revenue, a single primetime newscast shown on two stations could be a good thing from a revenue standpoint. Even if it is lackluster from a creative output. 

Some duopolies already do this, like WDJT/WMLW; the latter will 'technically originate' the 5:30 p.m. Sunday newscast and 5 pm. Saturday newscast, for example. But...most of the time it's pre-empted on WDJT for CBS Sports. Thus, WDJT will 'simulcast' those newscasts with the same ads from WMLW when they can, and be able to get two ratings in one. It's also the same for a combo unit like Western Mass News, which just takes a cume between WGGB and WSHM, and on some nights when Fox Sports pushes it beyond 11, WGGB-DT2 gives them a triple-cume number to work with. It just makes more sense than having two separate ad schedules to run when one will do the job just fine.

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If any network may want to be willing to go for a prime time newscast, I think it would be CBS since they are usually a distant third in ratings in the early evenings - maybe a 10 pm (or 9 pm CT) national news there (with the 6:30/5:30 pm timeslot yielded to an hour-long local newscast) would be able to break from the shadow of NBC Nightly News and World News Tonight.

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If NBC does give 10PM back to the local TV stations that CBS & ABC follow suit in my opinion. WOTV did have news in Battle Creek LIN shut that down in the summer of 03 which just simulcast Wood TV the final hour of Day Break at 6AM to 7AM, 6PM & 11PM M-F on weekends they air Access Hollywood Sat at 11PM & Extra Sun 11PM. Only newscast that isn't simulcast is 9AM Sat mornings on WOTV from 9AM to 10AM.

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For one thing, hasn't NBC learned its lesson from the disaster that was the Jay Leno Show?

 

And if NBC was to give up its 10pm/9pm central time slot: NBC Nightly News at 10pm/9pm and local newscast at the 10:30pm/9:30pm. Giving viewers a head start on a good night's sleep. 

 

Couldn't hurt to try something bold and do something never done before. 

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On 8/26/2022 at 12:23 PM, nickp said:

 ER was the number 1 show in the country three different years for NBC in that 10 PM slot with 30 million viewers a night

When people were still recording to VHS and watching on a 25-inch tube TV either on a 50-channel analog cable system or with rabbit ears. Nothing gets 30 million viewers a night anymore except for NFL Football.

 

What will be interesting is to see if they go through with this and how many stations add local news at 10 vs. syndicated shows. Will the ratings match up to Fox/netlet stations that have news? In my market, the NBC actually produces the 10:00 news for Fox, but only weeknights - weekends is a straight simulcast from Spokane (3 hrs away) on both Fox (from KAYU) and NBC (from KHQ-TV).

Meanwhile, in small and medium markets, the local revenue is drying up. Anyone can look up the news on their phones and most people 25-54 aren't watching TV news at all. On cable, while Fox News holds the fort at #1, only 1/3 of those viewers are under 55. How long before we see a purge of affiliates going defunct for good? Late 2020s? Early 2030s? Once the revenue dries up, the stations in market #160 can't keep broadcasting. Maybe even #100.

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On 8/28/2022 at 10:22 AM, Superdude said:

They're so desperate in making Peacock successful that they're willing to sacrifice the network in the process.

And Peacock WON'T be successful because of this...

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If there's a reason to suggest that NBC may be prone to cutting back on primetime, maybe one ought to take a look at how the Big Four networks stack up in terms of when they can fill their local newscast time, which admittedly has become quite more valuable than before in recent years. While politics obviously play a hand in this (especially with a 2022 midterm cycle that is good for Politics, Inc.), it provides stations with a reliable revenue generator as well for local advertisers, especially given that I have started seeing on the Big 3 plenty of direct response ads (e.g. Medicare Coverage Helpline, Bulbhead, etc.) airing where the latest Procter & Gamble product or cheesy insurance company ad would in the past.

 

With regards to Texas, take the Fox stations for instance. In Dallas/Fort Worth and Houston, the secondary Fox affiliates are simply used to provide second runs of most of the Fox O&O's syndicated shows, either utilizing an extension of the Fox O&O branding (as KDFI does in Dallas with "Fox 4 Plus") or a legacy branding most in a market remember (as KTXH does in Houston with "My 20 Vision", since many Houstonians still refer to it as "20 Vision" from the days of Star Trek: TNG, Arsenio Hall and most road games for the Astros and Rockets during the 80s and 90s).

 

Likewise, you have the CBS O&Os having their own duopolies with the secondary CBS affiliate (either the local CW O&O or an indie) airing primetime and morning extensions of their CBS O&O newscasts that go up against the 10 ET/9 CT hour of primetime or CBS Mornings, respectively, as KTVT does with independent KTXA in Fort Worth.

 

And while ABC O&Os don't have their own duopolies, it has begun airing primetime extensions of its newscasts on Nexstar's stations in markets where the local Nexstar station does not have its own in-house news department, with KIAH in Houston airing a primetime newscast from KTRK in the 9PM hour - a relationship that could in the future extend to 7 to 9 AM (unlikely given KIAH has its own traffic and weather-focused newscasts and their own meteorologists) while KTRK airs Good Morning America, a noon newscast against GMA3, or perhaps even KTRK's legacy 6PM newscast should CMV force ABC to carry Wheel of Fortune and Jeopardy! on all ABC O&Os in prime access or risk losing them to the CBS or Fox O&Os in the future. Ditto with Univision and its Unimas stations, which in Houston carry each other's SD feed on their spectrums.

 

NBC, by contrast does not have much leeway to extend its local news franchises into alternative timeslots beyond the traditional pre-Today, pre-primetime and early evening slots, and whatever opportunity it has to create English-language duopolies is taken by its Telemundo O&Os, as is the case with KXAS and KXTX in Fort Worth, and will likely be the case when Graham finally cashes out of the broadcast biz and inevitably sells KPRC to NBC, making it a duopoly to KTMD which already partners with KPRC on some community relations, news franchise and other matters. If anything, giving back one of the primetime hours to their affiliates in order to free up the last hour of primetime to allow the local affiliates to carry newscasts to generate revenue might seem "sustainable". But with many non-O&O NBC affiliates already airing primetime newscasts on duopoly stations, it may actually do harm than good, and NBC would be better off to beef up its LX sub channels to potentially serve as "backup NBC affiliates" as opposed to radically altering its primetime format to make up for either a lack of creativity or whatever constraints the FCC places on broadcast content as opposed to cable or streaming. (I mean, come on, it can't be the network's fault if Little Timmy gets scarred by some of the more explicit content (e.g. blood and guts on Law & Order, nurses cutting off clothes on ER) that was expected of NBC shows during their "Must See TV" golden age in the 90s!)

 

Lastly, why not utilize a promotion and relegation system with regards to scripted and even some reality programming? Like using Peacock and USA as "farm teams" with the stronger shows being promoted to NBC should something else fail on the (old school) Peacock but could have better value on USA. Maybe use NBC to air the legacy Law & Order and Law & Order: SVU and utilize USA to carry any other extensions of the franchise...

Edited by SS8609
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I do love that Comcast has a realistic expectation of where things will go cable and broadcast-wise, along with Disney and is making proper cuts to channels (witness Oxygen OTA in NBC O&O markets); compare this with Paramount Global, who has this happening this week with TeenNick (on top of Rob Dyrdek's de facto ownership of MTV);

 

 

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On 8/28/2022 at 7:07 PM, carolinanews4 said:

Could I learn more about why you said this? WRAZ airs a simulcast of WRAL News at 6 a.m., 12 p.m., 12:30 p.m. and 4 p.m. So why would FOX not allow a 10 p.m. simulcast?

 

4:30-7:00am

12:00-1:00pm

4:00-5:00pm

 

That's in addition to 7:00-10:00am and 10:00-11:00pm.

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53 minutes ago, TheRolyPoly said:

 

4:30-7:00am

12:00-1:00pm

4:00-5:00pm

 

That's in addition to 7:00-10:00am and 10:00-11:00pm.

@TheRolyPoly I'm not sure what you are responding to here. I know WRAL/WRAZ simulcast news in the morning, midday, and afternoon. I mentioned that in my response to the original poster that said WRAZ would have to change affiliations because FOX wouldn't allow a simulcast of WRAL. So I was letting the original poster know there are already time periods where news is simulcast on WRAZ.  

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6 hours ago, carolinanews4 said:

@TheRolyPoly I'm not sure what you are responding to here. I know WRAL/WRAZ simulcast news in the morning, midday, and afternoon. I mentioned that in my response to the original poster that said WRAZ would have to change affiliations because FOX wouldn't allow a simulcast of WRAL. So I was letting the original poster know there are already time periods where news is simulcast on WRAZ.  

Ah okay. My bad. Sorry for the confusion.

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22 hours ago, mrschimpf said:

I do love that Comcast has a realistic expectation of where things will go cable and broadcast-wise, along with Disney and is making proper cuts to channels (witness Oxygen OTA in NBC O&O markets); compare this with Paramount Global, who has this happening this week with TeenNick (on top of Rob Dyrdek's de facto ownership of MTV);

 

 

As a 90s kid - and more specifically a 90s Nickelodeon kid - this is definitely lazy. Though the week after with iCarly and America's Funniest Home Videos seems somewhat better. But if Paramount is just going to go waste on TeenNick, might as well do what NBC just did and free up the linear space for something more useful.

 

Also, look at the TV listings for Nicktoons - almost nothing but SpongeBob. The Nicktoons creative crew has fallen a long way from the days of Doug Funnie and a bunch of "dumb babies"...which may very well accurately describe Viacom's Paramount's cable management. Just like MTV2 is nothing more than "all Snooki, all Farrah Abraham, all the time" now. So much for the secondhand communications facility in Hauppauge that HBO handed down to them when HBO moved to Atlanta...

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13 minutes ago, SS8609 said:

As a 90s kid - and more specifically a 90s Nickelodeon kid - this is definitely lazy. Though the week after with iCarly and America's Funniest Home Videos seems somewhat better. But if Paramount is just going to go waste on TeenNick, might as well do what NBC just did and free up the linear space for something more useful.

 

We're probably getting off topic here, but I've been waiting for the contracting of linear cable television and the shedding of channels that aren't being watched, particularly among the multiplexers (HBO, Showtime, MTV, Nickelodeon, etc.) that have multiple flavors of themselves. I mean, do we really need several versions of MTV when there's often not enough new content to justify more than two?

 

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