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Question about Market/Network Dominance

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11 hours ago, AJClementeFan69 said:

Still...WWJ and KDNL are in major markets.

On the flip side, WCTV has OWNED the Tallahassee market for their entire existence.  Local competition didn't come until the mid 70s when WECA (now WTXL) signed on.  WALB beaming a strong signal from Albany made them a de-facto NBC affiliate for Tallahassee until WTWC signed on in the early 80s.  It was this that forced Gray to sell them when Gray bought WCTV.  All because WALB had a city grade signal in Thomasville, GA....where WCTV was licensed to.

Being a state capital makes it that more interesting.  Downstate Florida is a VERY different place from the Florida Panhandle....

Edited by tyrannical bastard
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20 hours ago, TVIntheDesert said:

 

I know that Perry Sook was once the sales manager of Pat Robertson's KXTX in Dallas, but is that why "The 700 Club" airs on many of Nexstar's Big 3-affiliated stations (the worst example is KOIN in Portland, which runs it at 1pm)?

 

20 hours ago, ColtFromGulfcoast said:

It's probably a coincedence that KOIN runs it because they may have been running it well before Nexstar got them. WAVY ran it during LIN and Media General ownership but I don't know if they still do today. 

 

This would explain why KTAL runs it, though. That and the fact that they pay stations to run the show.

 

19 hours ago, TVIntheDesert said:

WAVY is understandable, given that it's CBN's home market. That station even carries CBN's 24-hour news channel on a subchannel. As for KOIN airing it, there's no use for it only to go after viewers in Salem and other rural parts of the Portland market. But as long as the CBN checks clear, they'll air it. It's not good for the station's programming continuity during day, but neither are traditional infomercials.

The 700 Club airs at 9am on WVBT as of now. I’m not sure when it moved to WVBT, but it’s been very recently.

It was on WAVY for years until 2011 when they moved The Hampton Roads Show from WVBT. They didn’t exactly swap the two - 700 Club went to WTKR for a little while until they started Coast Live a couple years ago. Then it was on WGNT for a brief time, which coincidentally began as Pat Robertson’s first TV station, WYAH.

Speaking of WGNT and market dominance, it used to be one of the most dominant UPN and CW stations during its O&O ownership in the 2000s. Judge Judy consistently beat WTKR’s 6pm newscast during their infamous “Your NewsChannel 3” days.

 

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Are there any markets where they are ALL so inept that they are screaming for a new competitor? Or that a local cable news channel is competitive?

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35 minutes ago, SoFloTVClassics said:

*sighs* and yet there's still NO ONE discussing thr market network dominance in the Miami market.

Do the Spanish language stations still outrank the Big 4?  I remember when WTVJ was duopoly bait and almost acquired by WPLG because of NBC wanting out...

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Well just be thankful the 2008 deal was terminated. Otherwise it would have spelled the death of WTVJ. And no WTVJ would have remained and NBC affiliate.

 

 

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WSCV is still #1 at 11pm regardless of language. I think WSVN is still #1 in English despite WPLG adding more news left and right (which includes the new 3pm news).

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*sighs* WPLG has become a mini-version of WJXT or KRON. 

YUP. WSCV is still #1 in spanish, WSVN is still #1 and a virtual tie for second between WTVJ and WPLG

And what more can i say about WFOR.....

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2 hours ago, GoldenShine9 said:

Are there any markets where they are ALL so inept that they are screaming for a new competitor? Or that a local cable news channel is competitive?

Phoenix is a market where there's no true leader. However, KPNX used to put out press releases when they were number one, and it's been a while since they last did that. My feeling is that KTVK owns mornings and KSAZ evenings. KSAZ is not the best product in the market (in my opinion), but they've had the most consistency. On the Spanish front, I think KTAZ is neck-to-neck with KTVW these days too.

Edited by TVIntheDesert
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5 hours ago, SoFloTVClassics said:

*sighs* WPLG has become a mini-version of WJXT or KRON. 

YUP. WSCV is still #1 in spanish, WSVN is still #1 and a virtual tie for second between WTVJ and WPLG

And what more can i say about WFOR.....

Actually, I think WPLG is more of a mini-verison of KSNV during their Jim Rogers days... now trying to go all-news during the day and remain as is at night.

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On 11/13/2018 at 12:26 PM, KentBrockman said:

 

WSMV was once a powerhouse number 1 station, beating out WTVF in most timeslots until about the early 2000s when WTVF got more resources and was able to better compete. WSMV's dominance was due to it's people, the late Dan Miller, Demetria Kalodimos, Rudy Kalis, and the late Bill Hall. Kalis retired, Dan and Bill passed away, and everyone knows the one-sided story of what happened to Demetria.

 

With a dominant WTVF and a resurgent WKRN under Nexstar, WSMV is battling for 2nd and usually placing 3rd. In a market like Nashville, people "don't forget" and don't take change very well which has contributed to WSMV's demise.

 

They're working hard to rebuild the station to be dominant again, so they may be able to keep WKRN off of them, but I don't foresee them ever overtaking WTVF again unless their people retire/leave/die off and are replaced like what happened with WSMV. Also, Scripps has been able to continue to pour money and resources into WTVF that the other stations have not been able to get, like sending a reporter, photographer, and a sports anchor to London to cover the Tennessee Titans game.

Management has trashed that station inside and out over the past year or two.  They went from having a good, solid, straightforward presentation to one that tries too hard to be flashy and edgy.  The graphics overhaul is comical, even worse then their "lime green" look a decade ago.  And this is even before I mention all of the personnel moves that have clearly made the viewers flip away.

I tried to watch their show last night.  It wad sad to see what has become of them.

I'll give WKRN a try tonight and see if it's any better.

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13 hours ago, tyrannical bastard said:

Management has trashed that station inside and out over the past year or two.  They went from having a good, solid, straightforward presentation to one that tries too hard to be flashy and edgy.  The graphics overhaul is comical, even worse then their "lime green" look a decade ago.  And this is even before I mention all of the personnel moves that have clearly made the viewers flip away.

I tried to watch their show last night.  It wad sad to see what has become of them.

I'll give WKRN a try tonight and see if it's any better.

Your loss. We try really hard to do the best work we can, despite some internal issues. You should watch in support of the people who are not involved with those issues instead of not watching because of those who cause the issues.

It kills me when people will blame everyone at the station for problems when about 97% of us are just trying to do our jobs and make a paycheck and do as we are told. Don't blame me for your hatred of the station. We really do a great job when you look at our coverage and less at the asthetics.

WKRN is a joke. They run police blotter scare the hell out of you news coverage. Good luck.

Edited by KentBrockman
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1 hour ago, KentBrockman said:

Your loss. We try really hard to do the best work we can, despite some internal issues. You should watch in support of the people who are not involved with those issues instead of not watching because of those who cause the issues.

It kills me when people will blame everyone at the station for problems when about 97% of us are just trying to do our jobs and make a paycheck and do as we are told. Don't blame me for your hatred of the station. We really do a great job when you look at our coverage and less at the asthetics.

WKRN is a joke. They run police blotter scare the hell out of you news coverage. Good luck.

I apologize for my remarks.  You are correct about people just trying to make a living and doing what they are told.  It is the new norm as station groups have become more standardized and decisions are made far above the local level.

And for the stations (and their employees) that actually have a say in their local operations , more power to them.  As long as they're in touch with their viewers, that's the most important thing.

Had the documented string of events not happened, I think the perception would be much different, and it's the current staff that gets the blame.  Much of the people existed before the change and have been thrown into the fire as a result of the changes.

Upper management and those above them are to blame.  Their actions created a firestorm and their reactions are directly affected by it.  Now it these were clearly affected by the bottom line, then these were very difficult decisions that had to be made and the effects would have had to been realized eventually. 

We are all humans, and humans make mistakes.

Edited by tyrannical bastard
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13 hours ago, tyrannical bastard said:

I apologize for my remarks.  You are correct about people just trying to make a living and doing what they are told.  It is the new norm as station groups have become more standardized and decisions are made far above the local level.

And for the stations (and their employees) that actually have a say in their local operations , more power to them.  As long as they're in touch with their viewers, that's the most important thing.

Had the documented string of events not happened, I think the perception would be much different, and it's the current staff that gets the blame.  Much of the people existed before the change and have been thrown into the fire as a result of the changes.

Upper management and those above them are to blame.  Their actions created a firestorm and their reactions are directly affected by it.  Now it these were clearly affected by the bottom line, then these were very difficult decisions that had to be made and the effects would have had to been realized eventually. 

We are all humans, and humans make mistakes.

True. I accept your apology and I'm sorry for taking offense like I did. It's been a very trying time trying to help rebuild with negative publicity and push back from people who hate change.

And it's not like those who are causing the problems are making the situation better. :classic_dry:

Edited by KentBrockman
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WTVJ was #1 all throughout the Ralph Renick era, then after Ralph stepped down and (unsuccessfully) ran for Florida governor, WPLG with the late Ann Bishop and Dwight Lauderdale overtook them. WTVJ becoming an NBC O&O would open the floodgates for WSVN.

We thought WWL in New Orleans would be immune to TEGNAitis (they've been a powerhouse since the days of Garland Robinette, Angela Hill, and the late Bill Elder), but not anymore. The TEGNAitis bug hasn't hit KARE yet, but for right now, they've been battling for #2 with KMSP. KSTP, whose newscasts even beat out the primetime network shows at one point (including 60 Minutes, which became #1 in 1979-80), has long been a joke in the Twin Cities.

But despite WSB's dominance, the other three stations have been making serious gains against them, and it's showing. WAGA has a new news director in Scott Stucky (Mike McClain has moved on to Charlotte); WGCL, as the host station of Super Bowl LIII, has shown some growth in viewership; and TEGNAitis has done very little to WXIA.

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29 minutes ago, johnnya2k6 said:

WTVJ was #1 all throughout the Ralph Renick era, then after Ralph stepped down and (unsuccessfully) ran for Florida governor, WPLG with the late Ann Bishop and Dwight Lauderdale overtook them. WTVJ becoming an NBC O&O would open the floodgates for WSVN.

We thought WWL in New Orleans would be immune to TEGNAitis (they've been a powerhouse since the days of Garland Robinette, Angela Hill, and the late Bill Elder), but not anymore. The TEGNAitis bug hasn't hit KARE yet, but for right now, they've been battling for #2 with KMSP. KSTP, whose newscasts even beat out the primetime network shows at one point (including 60 Minutes, which became #1 in 1979-80), has long been a joke in the Twin Cities.

But despite WSB's dominance, the other three stations have been making serious gains against them, and it's showing. WAGA has a new news director in Scott Stucky (Mike McClain has moved on to Charlotte); WGCL, as the host station of Super Bowl LIII, has shown some growth in viewership; and TEGNAitis has done very little to WXIA.

And currently in the miami market, the ratings race is out of control. (except for ratings leader WSVN)

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On 11/28/2018 at 1:10 PM, Ntropolis said:

 

 

The 700 Club airs at 9am on WVBT as of now. I’m not sure when it moved to WVBT, but it’s been very recently.

It was on WAVY for years until 2011 when they moved The Hampton Roads Show from WVBT. They didn’t exactly swap the two - 700 Club went to WTKR for a little while until they started Coast Live a couple years ago. Then it was on WGNT for a brief time, which coincidentally began as Pat Robertson’s first TV station, WYAH.

Speaking of WGNT and market dominance, it used to be one of the most dominant UPN and CW stations during its O&O ownership in the 2000s. Judge Judy consistently beat WTKR’s 6pm newscast during their infamous “Your NewsChannel 3” days.

 

Beat me to answering the 700 Club related question.

 

As for the original question about markets with dominant NBC stations; to my knowledge the Hampton Roads region with WAVY still counts (particularly in the A.M.; WAVY becoming the area's dominant station during the 1990s following WTKR's ill-advised "TV3 News" branding and the mid-late 1990s talent exodus at that station; before being impacted in 2009 by the Jay Leno Show debacle and WTKR finally getting their act together around that time).

 

What's interesting to me here is that the local ABC affiliate, WVEC, doesn't get mentioned much at all in terms of local ratings. It's almost like WAVY and WTKR have been duking it out and WVEC has pretty much treaded water.

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On 12/17/2018 at 6:04 PM, WAVY 10 Fan said:

Beat me to answering the 700 Club related question.

 

As for the original question about markets with dominant NBC stations; to my knowledge the Hampton Roads region with WAVY still counts (particularly in the A.M.; WAVY becoming the area's dominant station during the 1990s following WTKR's ill-advised "TV3 News" branding and the mid-late 1990s talent exodus at that station; before being impacted in 2009 by the Jay Leno Show debacle and WTKR finally getting their act together around that time).

 

What's interesting to me here is that the local ABC affiliate, WVEC, doesn't get mentioned much at all in terms of local ratings. It's almost like WAVY and WTKR have been duking it out and WVEC has pretty much treaded water.

I've always thought in that 3 station market that WTKR was like a pretty distant 3rd, WVEC is a solid 2, and WAVY is number 1. Is that still true?

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3 hours ago, KentBrockman said:

I've always thought in that 3 station market that WTKR was like a pretty distant 3rd, WVEC is a solid 2, and WAVY is number 1. Is that still true?

WTKR has won the noon timeslot for years (TPIR effect) and they’ve claimed to win 8am, 7pm and 11pm this November.

http://www.tribunemedia.com/wtkr-news-3-hampton-roads-1-local-news-source-at-8am-noon-7pm-11pm/

WAVY’s still technically #1 but not as dominant as they were in the 90s/2000s.

Edited by Ntropolis
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KUSA has been dominate from the affiliate switch in 1995 to present, however they are starting to see ratings erosion to KDVR.   I would say prior to 1995 it was probably KCNC. (KCNC was an NBC O&O from 1986-1995.)  The only exception to this would be the 10pm news ratings, KUSA has been in control of that since the 80s. 

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59 minutes ago, DENDude said:

KUSA has been dominate from the affiliate switch in 1995 to present, however they are starting to see ratings erosion to KDVR.   I would say prior to 1995 it was probably KCNC. (KCNC was an NBC O&O from 1986-1995.)  The only exception to this would be the 10pm news ratings, KUSA has been in control of that since the 80s. 

That's pretty good for a TEGNA station how many other TEGNA stations can claim that they're number one in their market? Not very many

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2 hours ago, DENDude said:

KUSA has been dominate from the affiliate switch in 1995 to present, however they are starting to see ratings erosion to KDVR.   I would say prior to 1995 it was probably KCNC. (KCNC was an NBC O&O from 1986-1995.)  The only exception to this would be the 10pm news ratings, KUSA has been in control of that since the 80s. 

KUSA is not seeing erosion to KDVR and that is simply laughable. Tribunes outlet is due for a management change. People are jumping ship.

KUSA is seeing erosion to KCNC and a bit to KMGH, but KDVR and KMGH have swopped places not due to more successful content but because suckier management to over Tribune's outlet and KMGH saw a change as well to better news management (see Holly Gaunt and Dean Littleton, though I'd argue that the Denver7 branding is not helping anything, no matter what the focus groups said to Scripps).

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