Breaking: Cox/Fox swap stations, KTVU to become Fox O&O

[sanewsguy 509]

 

It has nothing to do with Cox's politics. They just don't believe in opinion or commentary when it comes to their TV stations, Doug pretty much came out and said that's what they told him. Cox keeps the opinion and commentaries to their AM/FM news talk stations. Just watch WSB, WHIO, or WFTV and notice that they don't have any commentaries or opinion based segments in their newscasts.

 

Sounds like they tried to find another place for him but he didn't want to. They both split up on good terms.

 

I just found out Cox canceled "Tulsa Live" (aka Great Day Green Country) on KOKI back in September so count them out of doing any local lifestyle shows too. In fact I don't think any of their other stations do local lifestyle shows. I guess they don't believe in those either...

 

A Cox newscast is very stale and boring. The anchors basically can't have a personality there. That's their formula. A formula I don't agree with. They're too stale for me to watch and as a news junkie that's saying a lot.

[NEOMatrix 1295]

It's going to be inevitable that WFXT is going to become a KTVU East, but hopefully that the same fate dosen't happen to WHBQ. I've noticed that Cox's Fox affiliates have a kind of staidness that shouldn't be on a Fox affiliate because it turns off younger viewers and older viewers won't turn into anything Fox unless it is called "Fox News". It works for WSB (the Toyota Camry of Atlanta Newscasts), and somewhat for pre-O&O KTVU (everyone knows they would ALWAYS downplay Fox) but for KOKI, WHBQ, and WFXT, it comes off as anti-Fox and almost CBS News-like.

[A3N 996]

Cox will make changes based on what they feel is in the best interest of the station/company. You guys may not like it, but it is what it is. I'm pretty sure that the suits at WFXT know that they cannot run the station like they did KTVU. but that does not mean they will not bring in some of their operating practices over. It is clear that things are not working, so they have no choice but to shake things up. Give it some time, and judge 3-6 months down the line, once the changes have been fully implemented.

[Mrtraveler01 737]

 

Ok, so lets take the opinions/politics/etc out of the equation and I have to say Cox will have a hard time to fill up the wheels. They got well over 60 hours of news a week and getting rid of things one by one is not the solution. If they know whats best for their viewers, they wouldn't be doing this mass exedous of what was once Fox 25. What's next the Zip Trip because they want to isolate the news personnel from their loyal viewers because afterall, wasn't sanewsguy that compared the KTVU anchors as robotic or lack personality?

 

As a former viewer to this station, I'd say the viewers have a lot to worry about. I've seen multiple bits of KTVU and I can say, it won't work for Boston, err New England. Just talking about the format here.

 

I think Cox is better off eliminating the 4:00 and 9:00 am slots, the 5:00 and 6:00 weekend programs.

 

If I come off as defensive, don't take it that I work for them, get paid by them or act as their spokesperson. I just don't like the direction, just as a viewer.

 

I understand your opinion and respect it.

 

But I mean no disrepect when I say that it doesn't matter to Cox when Fox 25 has been in the ratings basement for years. That's the only thing that they're taking into consideration and I would not be shocked if they cleaned house in a similar fashion to what they did in Jacksonville (a duopoly that was also the ratings dog in the market).

 

I do agree though that Cox's newscasts are stale which works in many of the markets that they're in. It's only a matter of time before we see if it works in Memphis and Boston.

[sanewsguy 509]

 

I do agree though that Cox's newscasts are stale which works in many of the markets that they're in. It's only a matter of time before we see if it works in Memphis and Boston.

 

I think what Cox doesn't realize is that WFXT, WHBQ, KOKI, Action News Jax and all these other stations don't really have a clear chance of winning. WCVB is a powerhouse in Boston and you can't really touch that station. Same in Memphis where you can't touch 3 and to a lesser extent, 5, no matter how good your newscast is. (I took a look at WMC the other day, their product is garbage and WREG isn't far behind. WATN has the best newscast there but they don't really have a chance of breaking #1 because habits are so entrenched).

 

In Jacksonville you can't touch 4. Not because their newscast is good (it's actually a pretty good newscast tho), but because viewership habits are so entrenched. Now First Coast News is garbage, but again people watch because they've been watching forever and also they have two stations they broadcast on.

 

Remember the majority of news viewers are older audiences so they've likely been watching the same stations for years, if not decades. (I hate to stereotype it that badly but it's very true)

 

If Cox feels their changes will help them in the ratings, more power to them. But I personally don't feel their changes will help them in the long run. WSOC, WSB, WFTV do so well because they've been around so long and have had time to penetrate the market. And of course Atlanta is Cox's home market (enough said).

 

Cox's formula doesn't work because the stations are so well. The stations are so well likely because the dials are "rusted" on those stations like here on KSAT where they have viewers who treat the morning weather guy like he's the almighty and didn't get the memo they stopped using the title "NewsWatch" over 25 years ago.

 

As someone above said, Cox's formula doesn't really fit a Fox station that well. Their formula is like "CBS News", just without the dull monotone of Scott Pelley. Although everything else about the newscast fits the bill. On Good Morning Memphis the anchors actually have a personality and I don't think Cox likes that. They want their anchors to put you to sleep. Maybe that's also why they don't like lifestyle shows...

 

I'm not knocking Cox. They're a great company who takes care of their employees and I think they know what they're doing to serve their own interests (for better or worse). I just wouldn't watch their newscasts. Decent newspaper operation. Maybe they're trying to bring the newspaper format to TV...

[mre29 1340]

Now you're making me wish Cox had passed on WFXT and waited for WHDH to become available. Now there's a station that needs to be un-tabloidified.

[cbs2newengland 71]

 

I just found out Cox canceled "Tulsa Live" (aka Great Day Green Country) on KOKI back in September so count them out of doing any local lifestyle shows too. In fact I don't think any of their other stations do local lifestyle shows. I guess they don't believe in those either...

 

A Cox newscast is very stale and boring. The anchors basically can't have a personality there. That's their formula. A formula I don't agree with. They're too stale for me to watch and as a news junkie that's saying a lot.

 

It would only be a matter of time if more WFXT talent leaves the door, like a Maria Stephanos. I said this earlier, you can't turn her bubbly style into a cold hearted bitch. I bet she/they wouldn't renew when her contract expires, whenever that happens. WFXT invested in personality (as well as recruiting local born and bred people too.) I bet both of those recent practices will be broken.

 

 

 

It's going to be inevitable that WFXT is going to become a KTVU East, but hopefully that the same fate dosen't happen to WHBQ. I've noticed that Cox's Fox affiliates have a kind of staidness that shouldn't be on a Fox affiliate because it turns off younger viewers and older viewers won't turn into anything Fox unless it is called "Fox News". It works for WSB (the Toyota Camry of Atlanta Newscasts), and somewhat for pre-O&O KTVU (everyone knows they would ALWAYS downplay Fox) but for KOKI, WHBQ, and WFXT, it comes off as anti-Fox and almost CBS News-like.

 

Well you can't take Fox away from 25. For over a generation it was a Fox O&O (even when it wasn't owned by them for those few years in the 90s.) It's taking away the identity of the station.

 

 

 

I understand your opinion and respect it.

 

But I mean no disrepect when I say that it doesn't matter to Cox when Fox 25 has been in the ratings basement for years. That's the only thing that they're taking into consideration and I would not be shocked if they cleaned house in a similar fashion to what they did in Jacksonville (a duopoly that was also the ratings dog in the market).

 

I do agree though that Cox's newscasts are stale which works in many of the markets that they're in. It's only a matter of time before we see if it works in Memphis and Boston.

 

 

 

Cox will make changes based on what they feel is in the best interest of the station/company. You guys may not like it, but it is what it is. I'm pretty sure that the suits at WFXT know that they cannot run the station like they did KTVU. but that does not mean they will not bring in some of their operating practices over. It is clear that things are not working, so they have no choice but to shake things up. Give it some time, and judge 3-6 months down the line, once the changes have been fully implemented.

 

I understand your point fully, if anything Cox will have to expect the station to perform at 3rd place, than distant 4th. If anything these ratings problems are with an asterisk. It's a news market of 4 stations (5 if you count WMUR in the border region where I know people in the northern Middlesex and Essex counties often tune to WMUR, believe it or not!) sanewsguy is right, WCVB is established, and they won't compete against them. Somewhere inside me thinks they believe they can, but I think they're screwing themselves in that point.

 

 

Now you're making me wish Cox had passed on WFXT and waited for WHDH to become available. Now there's a station that needs to be un-tabloidified.

 

 

I don't get the hatred to WHDH. Don't get me wrong, I grew up in the latter years of David Mugar's ownership of Channel 7, however as I got older, I saw things differently than when I was a kid. I did have the set on 7 and watched Margie and RD, and Lester Strong at noon. However the people at 7 seemed to be the snooty journalists, and their snootiness got more apparent after the Sunbeam sale. Am I biased to Sunbeam? No, I think the WSVN format that came right during the NBC demise really turned even the loyal fans away. But in 1993, they were killing the idea before the WHDH concept came to be. It was more flashy, a little tight in the storylines, and it disrupted the market in the news delivery. However many years later WHDH can be taken as a joke with the WSVN style that creeped in. Though if Cox were to buy WHDH, there would be a lot of cleaning up to do. They are probably better off not buying them. I think it will be much easier for Cox to clean out WFXT.

[sanewsguy 509]

 

It would only be a matter of time if more WFXT talent leaves the door, like a Maria Stephanos. I said this earlier, you can't turn her bubbly style into a cold hearted bitch. I bet she/they wouldn't renew when her contract expires, whenever that happens. WFXT invested in personality (as well as recruiting local born and bred people too.) I bet both of those recent practices will be broken.

 

Oh yeah, no doubt. For many positions, Cox seems to be big on developing talent from within their own ranks rather than hire externally. Like they'll hire reporters and weekend anchors externally, but for the weeknight positions they really like to bring in people from their own ranks. Brian Monahan is a great example: he moved from WFTV to KIRO and now Cox's big dog in Atlanta WSB. Another great example is WJAX, where Cox brought in two anchors, one from WSB, another from WSOC. Their new morning meteorologist is a former intern at WSB too. When Fox bought KOKI, their old weeknight co-anchor left and was replaced by a reporter from WSB.

 

No doubt will Cox try to do some of that in Boston. They like to make their mark known. Give it some time but it will show up. Same with WHBQ, they'll probably put their stamp on them too. It's just a matter of time.

[cbs2newengland 71]

 

Oh yeah, no doubt. For many positions, Cox seems to be big on developing talent from within their own ranks rather than hire externally. Like they'll hire reporters and weekend anchors externally, but for the weeknight positions they really like to bring in people from their own ranks. Brian Monahan is a great example: he moved from WFTV to KIRO and now Cox's big dog in Atlanta WSB. Another great example is WJAX, where Cox brought in two anchors, one from WSB, another from WSOC. Their new morning meteorologist is a former intern at WSB too. When Fox bought KOKI, their old weeknight co-anchor left and was replaced by a reporter from WSB.

 

No doubt will Cox try to do some of that in Boston. They like to make their mark known. Give it some time but it will show up. Same with WHBQ, they'll probably put their stamp on them too. It's just a matter of time.

 

So I guess another thing about Cox is there is little job security at the stations and its not about loyalty to them I see? What am I kidding, that backs up the theory of KTVU anchors lacking a heart on camera. :/

[sanewsguy 509]

 

So I guess another thing about Cox is there is little job security at the stations and its not about loyalty to them I see? What am I kidding, that backs up the theory of KTVU anchors lacking a heart on camera. :/

 

It's more about loyalty to the company (Cox) not loyalty to the station. They don't care about people hired under Fox, they care more about people brought up from under their own ranks.

[Rusty Muck 4164]

Well you can't take Fox away from 25. For over a generation it was a Fox O&O (even when it wasn't owned by them for those few years in the 90s.) It's taking away the identity of the station.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cox ultimately does to WHBQ and WFXT what LocalTV did to KDVR... clear away the homogenous, standardized "O&O" look completely for a unique design and identity.

 

KDVR still calls itself "Fox 31" but that's about it.

[cbs2newengland 71]

 

It's more about loyalty to the company (Cox) not loyalty to the station. They don't care about people hired under Fox, they care more about people brought up from under their own ranks.

 

That's one heluvla a culture clash given how WFXT ran the station on the idea of news talent being loyal to all the things that make New England speecial. This practice seems to date for many years (maybe for about a decade) and such actions was addressed in the news promos as Maria Stephanos would do often.

 

I will say this for the last time, this is going to be interesting to see this progress. I so wished Jessica Heslam would write about the local media every Thursday in the Boston Herald again.

[cbs2newengland 71]

This is really devastating, per to the Boston Herald's Inside Track: (can we call the thread: What will Cox f*ck up next for WFXT?)

 

The departure of VB, aka Doug Goudie, wasn’t the only change coming to “Fox 25 Morning News.”

The station’s new owners have decreed that there will be no more in-studio interviews and, in fact, the only topics under discussion during the newscasts will be breaking news, weather, sports, consumer or business stories.

Which means that the morning show, which was designed to be a local version of the popular “Today” show and “Good Morning America” formats, will now become just another in the loooong line of daytime news programs.

The comments are speculating like I have if the Zip Trip will be yanked, I think they shouldn't hold their breath - its the next thing gone. That and that SNG truck that allows them to do that. I think the next thing to go is if any of the sports teams wins a title, they won't cover the parade because they can't show happy emotions of our local teams wining those titles. (never mind the Cox carpetbaggers potentially being the talent if Boston goes into a drought/curse.)

[scrabbleship 427]

Time for WBZ to expand their morning newscast to WSBK to fill what will be a gaping hole?

[cbs2newengland 71]

 

Time for WBZ to expand their morning newscast to WSBK to fill what will be a gaping hole?

 

They tried a couple of times, what would make the third try work?

[cbs2newengland 71]

 

I wouldn't be surprised if Cox ultimately does to WHBQ and WFXT what LocalTV did to KDVR... clear away the homogenous, standardized "O&O" look completely for a unique design and identity.

 

KDVR still calls itself "Fox 31" but that's about it.

 

I guess, but a few people call it WFXT here, many associate it as the network's product. Even if Cox makes it like KDVR or KTVU, I think the branding change won't get people's attention of that makes any sense.

 

I'm calling Cox as a homewrecker. I'm actually not liking what they are doing given the most recent developments. They'll have to really woo me if these changes are for the better.

[NEOMatrix 1295]

With the same fate coming to WHBQ, I wonder if WATN will FINALLY be able take 3rd place from WHBQ and finally be taken seriously compared to WMC and WREG.

[Rusty Muck 4164]

I guess, but a few people call it WFXT here, many associate it as the network's product. Even if Cox makes it like KDVR or KTVU, I think the branding change won't get people's attention of that makes any sense.

KDVR isn't branded by their calls. It's still "Fox 31" but without the homogenized (and boring IMO) O&O look.

 

I don't think anyone should be surprised at what is happening to WFXT. But the real blame should be laid at Fox itself because they instigated this mess. Cox is only doing what they normally do with their TV ops.

[cbs2newengland 71]

 

KDVR isn't branded by their calls. It's still "Fox 31" but without the homogenized (and boring IMO) O&O look.

 

I don't think anyone should be surprised at what is happening to WFXT. But the real blame should be laid at Fox itself because they instigated this mess. Cox is only doing what they normally do with their TV ops.

 

You seem to be a pompous ass - lecturing the people who aren't familiar with Cox that we MUST HAD known about them right at the time of the deal. Let me be serious, if you know so much about Cox, tell us what the fuck do you know that the rest of us (not familiar with Cox) do not?

 

Enlighten us!

[Rusty Muck 4164]

You seem to be a pompous ass - lecturing the people who aren't familiar with Cox that we MUST HAD known about them right at the time of the deal. Let me be serious, if you know so much about Cox, tell us what the fuck do you know that the rest of us (not familiar with Cox) do not?

 

Enlighten us!

I think everyone else is saying what needs to be said about how Cox does business.

 

Ask yourself if Cox really wants to be in Boston and Memphis, and if they really wanted to lose KTVU. They aren't Fox, and weren't and aren't going to keep the Fox MO in place on either WFXT or WHBQ.

 

And ask yourself if drive-by calling someone a pompous ass is the productive thing to do. You seem to be the only one who is taking this story waaaaaaaaaaay too personally.

[cbs2newengland 71]

 

I think everyone else is saying what needs to be said about how Cox does business.

 

Ask yourself if Cox really wants to be in Boston and Memphis, and if they really wanted to lose KTVU. They aren't Fox, and weren't and aren't going to keep the Fox MO in place on either WFXT or WHBQ.

 

And ask yourself if drive-by calling someone a pompous ass is the productive thing to do. You seem to be the only one who is taking this story waaaaaaaaaaay too personally.

 

I'm not taking it personally; I think Cox is going to make the Boston DMA down to 3 stations. That's the truth. We are in a capitalistic society where news is market driven, and if the locals do not like what Cox delivers, they are going suffer with a third class local news operation with worse ratings and probably advertisers will likely pay less too. I really don't like what they are doing. And I was a loyal viewer back in the glory days a decade ago, thank you very much.

[swillh2k2 203]

I'm not taking it personally; I think Cox is going to make the Boston DMA down to 3 stations. That's the truth. We are in a capitalistic society where news is market driven, and if the locals do not like what Cox delivers, they are going suffer with a third class local news operation with worse ratings and probably advertisers will likely pay less too. I really don't like what they are doing. And I was a loyal viewer back in the glory days a decade ago, thank you very much.

I think you're overblowing this a little.

It's no different from any other time when a station changes hands and the new owners want to instill their philosophy. Sometimes it's more subtle while other times it's very noticeable. Those chanes take different forms, like new graphics, sets and music, new faces, to something as simple as tweaking the delivery.

Cox is going to do what they think is right. Will it pay off? I'm not sure. I don't live in Boston so it doesn't affect me at all. All we can do is wait and see what happens.

[cbs2newengland 71]

 

I think you're overblowing this a little.

It's no different from any other time when a station changes hands and the new owners want to instill their philosophy. Sometimes it's more subtle while other times it's very noticeable. Those chanes take different forms, like new graphics, sets and music, new faces, to something as simple as tweaking the delivery.

Cox is going to do what they think is right. Will it pay off? I'm not sure. I don't live in Boston so it doesn't affect me at all. All we can do is wait and see what happens.

 

 

Well if you don't follow WFXT or live in the market, then probably don't know the product.

 

repeating from the quote in the Boston Herald again:

 

The departure of VB, aka Doug Goudie, wasn’t the only change coming to “Fox 25 Morning News.”

 

The station’s new owners have decreed that there will be no more in-studio interviews and, in fact, the only topics under discussion during the newscasts will be breaking news, weather, sports, consumer or business stories.

 

Which means that the morning show, which was designed to be a local version of the popular “Today” show and “Good Morning America” formats, will now become just another in the loooong line of daytime news programs.

 

The station was built on personality, light and hard news, opinions that could offend some, and newscast that mixed lighter topics with the mornings pressing stories.

 

This is what the makeup of what made Fox 25 what it was (and would've never happened if Newscorp didn't buy them in 1996.) Now FTS leaves the market and its likely back to those dark days of the 90s again.

 

I really don't like Boston the city in itself and it's its very small DMA compared to markets like NY or even Philadelphia. There is 4 stations producing its own news, and if Cox does get that wrecking ball fired up, then the market will likely go down to 3.5 stations (25 would become .5 of a news operation.) I guess NECN is an option, only if people have cable, some don't. I think its time for user generated video community to disrupt a broken media market. I think some people probably be able to do better newsgathering than the establishment stations.

[Mrtraveler01 737]

I'm not taking it personally; I think Cox is going to make the Boston DMA down to 3 stations. That's the truth. We are in a capitalistic society where news is market driven, and if the locals do not like what Cox delivers, they are going suffer with a third class local news operation with worse ratings and probably advertisers will likely pay less too. I really don't like what they are doing. And I was a loyal viewer back in the glory days a decade ago, thank you very much.

How can ratings get any worse? They're already last in ever slot except 10pm. If you're that worried about the product changing that much, there's still WHDH.

[Mrtraveler01 737]

I think you're overblowing this a little.

It's no different from any other time when a station changes hands and the new owners want to instill their philosophy. Sometimes it's more subtle while other times it's very noticeable. Those chanes take different forms, like new graphics, sets and music, new faces, to something as simple as tweaking the delivery.

Cox is going to do what they think is right. Will it pay off? I'm not sure. I don't live in Boston so it doesn't affect me at all. All we can do is wait and see what happens.

Considering WFXT's current spot in the ratings basement, I wouldn't be surprised if they did something similar to what they did in Jacksonville.